Okay, so I recently started dating this girl, and I was happy with her. Well, I had a doubt again about whether or not I was gay (gah!!), and I decided to confide in her because I thought she would understand. She told me she was bi and would totally have sex with her best friend if she had the opportunity.
So, she breaks up with me and tells me she's not ready to date. 9 days later, she gets into a relationship with her best friend... Seeing this, I confront her about the real reason why she broke up with me... She says to me "just that you need to figure urself out." Oh, okay, I'm glad you decided what I needed to do with MY life. I made it clear to her that I had no interest in spending my life with a guy, but I guess that wasn't good enough...
So, here's what I don't get... Why are you breaking up with me because I need to "figure myself out", when you're telling me you're bi and would totally have sex with your best friend if given the opportunity? I was okay with that, and she told me she would be okay with any doubts I had (which would have gone away). I mean, seriously, wtf?!
The good news is, I walk away from the breakup with my head held high and the satisfaction that I did not end up with the wrong person. Oh, and I have a joke out of it. Her boyfriend's name is Tarzan, so I tell people: "Margo dumped me for Tarzan!!" XD It would have been funnier if her name was Jane... <_<
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So long as you are dating gals, it might be wise to wait a while before talking about your feelings for dudes. But! Possibly she broke up with you because she decided that, come to think of it, she really did prefer this friend she admitted to already having her eyes on, and the bit about you needing to figure yourself out was just a lame excuse. Although it probably wouldn't hurt to make your ideas about why you're so opposed to dating men a bit more coherent.
I'm having a little trouble understanding the logic behind this story, though. This sentence:
She told me she was bi and would totally have sex with her best friend if she had the opportunity…
implies that the best friend is female, but then you say:
she gets into a relationship with her best friend… Her boyfriend's name is Tarzan…
so I'm confused.
I guess it's just like they say: everybody wants an epic boyfriend.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/2000083-paper-mario-social/59396519#10
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
Also, sexist topic title is sexist.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
Well, Margo has more than one "best friend". I meant to say "have sex with her best girlfriend" . And it's not that I have feelings for dudes... That's why I know I'm not gay. To me, sex is just sex. It doesn't matter who it's with. The emotions have to be there, though, and I don't feel romantically attached to any dudes...
I think it was a lame excuse to bow out of dating me because she had stronger feelings for another guy. One of our mutual friends admitted she wasn't surprised Margo broke up with me because, apparently, she was confused about liking three different guys...
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
From: Ringofsealing | Posted: 7/7/2011 7:58:06 PM | #004
To me, sex is just sex. It doesn't matter who it's with.
So it is for us all.
…Or so I heard.
The emotions have to be there, though, and I don't feel romantically attached to any dudes...
Fair 'nuff.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
...you're telling me you're bi and would totally have sex with your best friend if given the opportunity? I was okay with that...
Is this not jumping out at anyone else? Gender doesn't really matter with this...
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Well, there is a new accent of n00b language. It's called: Vet LUEser goes Foreign!-MegaSpy22
Those must be the pants of the gods!-Digitalpython
I don't know what you mean, LP1.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
I'm not sure what you mean, either. The point is, the excuse she gave me for breaking up with me was that I needed to figure myself out, despite the fact that I told her that I was not interested in dating a guy. The irony of the situation is that she's breaking up with me for something she would do that I was fine with, but it's not okay if I have doubts. You're right, gender has nothing to do with it. The idea behind that is she's being hypocritical because it's okay if she does it, but my doubts are not okay even though they're related to the same concept.
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
Okay, what I was getting at is that you literally gave her the okay for her to go have sex with her best friend while you 2 were going out. Most girls don't LIKE that in a guy. If that's not what you meant, change your word choice then.
2, it's not hypocritical on her end for 1 reason. She's definitely sure she's bi. You're acting a bit bi curious. Instead of trying to force you to decide one way or another, she'll let you sort out your own problems (and since you're acting like it wasn't really a big deal, that was probably for the best). Chances are, her working her feelings out on her own when they started to come up was the best option for her, so perhaps she thought it would work out best for you.
Now, was the breakup necessary? I have no idea. You really don't want to be going out with a girl who's having thoughts about another dude...
Also just gonna say that it's normal for anyone to have homosexual thoughts. It's kinda like suicide, everyone thinks about it at some point in their lives. It's natural.
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Well, there is a new accent of n00b language. It's called: Vet LUEser goes Foreign!-MegaSpy22
Those must be the pants of the gods!-Digitalpython
Hey wait, why should vague sexual preferences be considered a problem to be solved? It's not as if Anthony is necessarily in some quantum superposition of sexualities that must eventually collapse into a standard orientation and it's his job to hasten the process by systematically kissing different classes of people or looking at different classes of pornography. He may never change. And it's not as if he can ever be certain what's there: who isn't occasionally surprised by what they do or don't find erotic? Who even has ultimate knowledge of their own taste in music?
What I'm sayin' is, I doubt that sexual experimentation actually works. If it did, then sexuality would be the unique personality characteristic for which people could gain profound self-knowledge by mere introspection.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
But I don't want to be gay... And I never had this problem until somebody said something to me a few years ago. I honestly would have never given the random homosexual thoughts a care in the world. I think my problem is psychological. Constantly being bullied, called a ***, associated with being a girl... All of that with people who knew me saying I was gay and then someone who didn't know me saying it. I thought that maybe now since a bunch of people were saying it, it must be true. The drive to find out if there's anything for real is what is bugging me. Honestly, though, I don't want to be gay. I want to a wife and kids, I have no interest in being romantic with a guy. I can honestly say that without feeling weird.
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
If we absolutely must fit our sexualities into taxonomies, the dual-axis model favored by the AVENites could be helpful here. The idea is that there are separate romantic and sexual axes, which influence which genders you'd enjoy having as sex partners and boos, respectively. So you could be a "homoromantic homosexual" or a "heteromantic bisexual" or even an "aromantic heterosexual".
Now, we seem to get along just fine without labeling people according to which flavors of ice cream they like. Maybe you like vanilla. Maybe you like chocolate. Maybe you like both. Maybe you like vanilla a lot but chocolate only a little. Maybe you like chocolate in ice-cream sodas but when you're getting a cone it's vanilla with rainbow sprinkles or nothing. Maybe you enjoy the idea of vanilla but chocolate always seems to taste better in practice. Maybe ice cream in general fails to excite you. Maybe you're just not a fan of ice cream, however good it tastes, and at times you wish that man had never domesticated the cow.
Not that I'm bitter.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
But that's the thing... I don't know if I legitimately like guys, or if it's just in my head from what was said. As I was saying, prior to that, the occasional thought would pop into my head, but I would brush it away as if it were nothing. Things started taking a turn for the worse after that. It's not a big deal, true, but you're supposed to be able to figure that out on your own. Without any type of influence, coaching, or opinions, I'm straight.
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
Okay, what I was getting at is that you literally gave her the okay for her to go have sex with her best friend while you 2 were going out. Most girls don't LIKE that in a guy. If that's not what you meant, change your word choice then.
It wasn't so much giving her the okay, but it was being respectful and understanding of her other tendencies. I was trying to be understanding that she was bi and okay with that. Obviously if I'm in a relationship with someone, I'd prefer them only having sex with me... I wasn't trying to be judgmental, something she clearly failed at... In a relationship, you're not supposed to judge one another. If you want to judge my doubts and label me a bisexual or homosexual, you're not the person for me...
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From: Ringofsealing | Posted: 7/9/2011 9:29:10 AM | #013
I don't know if I legitimately like guys, or if it's just in my head from what was said.
But I don't think this distinction is legitimate. I mean, going back to the ice-cream analogy, it isn't as if some of your feelings about ice cream are essential and inborn and some are merely forced onto you by constant suggestions about what you should like. Can what other people say about ice cream or your preferences for ice cream influence said preferences? Yes. Can your decisions about what ice cream to try or not try influence your preferences? Yes. But they're your preferences, however you got 'em. It's no use crying over spilt ice cream (spilt semen? spilt milt?).
While you
can draw a distinction between your true preferences and preferences you don't actually feel but
pretend to feel, that's not an issue here. As far as I can tell, you haven't misrepresented your sexual feelings to anybody. Not even yourself.
And mind, I'm not saying you have to
act according to your preferences. I won't criticize people who can enjoy ice cream but never eat it. Except, of course, people whose ice-cream decisions are founded on questionable beliefs about empirical matters.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
^ I, as always, don't think Tony is gay. In fact, I'd be willing to bet that he isn't.
As much as I hate to say it, I think this is a result of you spending so much time with females and very little with males. Throws off the balance. Now, as you all know, I'm down for a little man-to-woman time even if it's just hanging out, but "bro time" is essential to any man's life.
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"A special effect without a story is a pretty boring thing." - George Lucas
But gosh darnit, man, my whole point is that it isn't even an empirical question whether or not somebody is gay! It's just a matter of how you choose to describe a person's messily heterogeneous set of preferences. You can't sensibly place a bet on whether Tony is gay any more than you can bet on whether or not he's a nice guy. In psychological research, the operational definition of "sexual orientation" is nearly always along the lines of "what the subject says when you ask 'Are you gay?'".
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
I don't think so either, Brandon... Like I said, it's all in my head. There are certain things that cause me to have doubts, but they go away when other things happen. For example, my graduation party. I was grinding all over the dance floor and came a little. What gay guy loves a girl's ass up on him? So, there are instances where I think to myself that it's just in my head. The whole thing is getting a bit ridiculous, though... I just want it to be over.
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
From: Ringofsealing | Posted: 7/11/2011 11:39:35 AM | #018
Like I said, it's all in my head… What gay guy loves a girl's ass up on him?
You're mindlessly buying into a folk theory of sexual preferences that (a) has no empirical basis and (b) seems to be giving you a lot of grief. If you're not willing to examine it critically, well, I give up.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
But you don't understand... I HAVE BEEN looking at it critically since I was 13 (you can ask Brandon and Jakob). I'm tired of analyzing and trying to figure out if there's anything else. I just want to be the person I was before I had any kind of outside influence...
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
*vomits*
TMI. Dear God TMI...
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Well, there is a new accent of n00b language. It's called: Vet LUEser goes Foreign!-MegaSpy22
Those must be the pants of the gods!-Digitalpython
I'm not asking you to question your preferences. You've already done that quite enough. I'm asking you to question the way you think about preferences.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
Two things:
13??? Holy crap! Have I known you that long? You're what, 17 now? 4 years? I guess. 2007 seems about right. WOW.
It's called "pre-cum". That's totally natural and pretty much happens ANY time any sexual behavior occurs. Like, even just making out with a girl often can result in that.
God, I'm getting modded for that.
Moderators of GameFAQS: this is a PURELY scientific topic with a medical explanation. PLEASE don't punish me.
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"A special effect without a story is a pretty boring thing." - George Lucas
Yes, Brandon, I know what it's called, lol.
Also, there's no reason to analyze how I think about preferences. I wouldn't have them if people would stop trying to label me and influence me. It's simple: I want a wife and kids. I have always wanted that. Just because someone says they think I'm ***, doesn't mean I am. At no point prior to outside influences did I ever feel like I was ***, so I'm sticking with that.
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
You're being quite dense and not reading what Kodi says, and I find that lack of reading comprehension, as a teacher, to be offensive.
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"To truly live, one must first be born." ~ Evan [aX]
Paper Mario Social: The Safe Haven of GameFAQs. (Board 2000083)
No, I am reading what he says. He's not getting what I want, though. I don't want to like things because I'm persuaded by others. Look at his ice cream example. He says it doesn't matter how we like the things we do, the point is we do. I get that. In my case, though, I don't want to like things because I'm persuaded to, I want to like things because I want to like them. Get it now?
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
*facedesk*
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Well, there is a new accent of n00b language. It's called: Vet LUEser goes Foreign!-MegaSpy22
Those must be the pants of the gods!-Digitalpython
I do now, Tony. Thank you. (And thank you, James.) The problem is that you can't deliberately control your preferences. For decades, clinicians have tried all kinds of interventions to reduce and eliminate homosexual inclinations. None have proved effective (http://apa.org/monitor/2009/10/orientation.aspx). There are pharmacological means to induce sexual dysfunction (I'm on paroxetine right now for exactly that purpose), but not to reduce your same-sex feelings without affecting your opposite-sex feelings.
You seem to believe that once certain influences are removed, your same-sex feelings will disappear likewise. This probably isn't true.
Is it monstrously unfair that we have no direct control over our sexual feelings? Yes. Psychology has a way of being unfair. The rule is: you can't control your thoughts and feelings; you can only control your behavior. Go ahead and date women alone if you like, but don't count on your feelings for men going away. That's the human condition for you.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
I just want to be the person I was before I had any kind of outside influence...
A newborn baby? My point being, your belief that you were heterosexual was also caused by outside influences.
No, I am reading what he says. He's not getting what I want, though. I don't want to like things because I'm persuaded by others. Look at his ice cream example. He says it doesn't matter how we like the things we do, the point is we do. I get that. In my case, though, I don't want to like things because I'm persuaded to, I want to like things because I want to like them. Get it now?
Look. I'm guessing you have a favorite color. For the sake of this discussion, I'll pretend it is blue. If I asked you why you like the color blue, I'd be very surprised if you knew why. And yet, though I can't disprove this fact, I seriously doubt that your favorite color was determined purely by genetics. I'm not saying that genetics couldn't influence what your favorite color was, but I'm saying that if all I had was your DNA, I couldn't figure out what your favorite color was, meaning that life experience determined your favorite color, at least in part. Life experience IS outside influence. So trying to figure out what your favorite color "really" is would end up, if done in a pure and proper form, trying to determine what your favorite color was based upon your DNA, which as I've already argued, doesn't seem possible.
There's another point of Kodi's that you don't seem to have acknowledged much, if at all, which I see as one that deserves a good look. He's trying to tell you that maybe, your sexuality cannot be defined in one word and that maybe, it never will be. Consider this; I've got a book in front of me that has lavender and light blue stripes. If you were to imagine it, the colors that you imagine almost definitely wouldn't match the actual colors of the stripes. I cannot attest to knowing the physics of color, but there are millions of colors, if not more. There are many that would acceptably be described as light blue, and many that would acceptably be described as lavender. There's also an "ideal" light blue and an "ideal" lavender that you think of when you hear the word without seeing the color itself.* The actual shade is lost to you. But I've seen the color, and know the color. I don't have to think of it as an idealized lavender or light blue, I can think about it in the way that it really is, without language limiting the ways I see it. I may use words to describe it for the convenience of others, but in reality, it is its own special color.
*These "ideal" colors likely aren't the same for each individual, and could very well change over time. For example, if everyone around me starts referring to brick red as "red," and "normal" red as something else, then I may start to have brick red as my "ideal" red. Furthermore, the context in which the colors are mentioned might change them as well; if told to imagine red, white, and blue, I may be more likely to pick the specific shades used in the American flag, whether or not these are my usual "ideal" shades.
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If you're a human and not feeling creative, make this your signature.
Several points, then:
- Just because you do have feelings when a girl grinds up against you doesn't negate any other feelings you might have. I, too, enjoy a girl grinding up against me in the same way, and I have a boyfriend.
- You need to understand Kodi's point about the two-axis spectrum. It's defined as "romantic interest" on one axis and "sexual interest" on the other. It is very possible for you to be all the way on the "hetero" side of the romance axis but closer to the middle on the sexual axis. That is why you "want" to be a certain way, but that doesn't change what feelings you have. And that's fine!
- There are lots of people who are in a similar area on the spectrum. Most don't act on it, have a wife, kids, etc. Some do. They're often classified as MSM or, if black/hispanic, DL, and sometimes even have wives while they do.
- I thought similarly to you when I was your age.
- No one wants to change your sexual orientation. After all, orientation is defined, as Kodi said before, as "whatever the person says they are when you ask." We just want you to know what you're talking about when you say things.
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"To truly live, one must first be born." ~ Evan [aX]
Paper Mario Social: The Safe Haven of GameFAQs. (Board 2000083)
From: Jacehan | Posted: 7/12/2011 10:16:46 AM | #030
That is why you "want" to be a certain way…
I actually think he'd be even less comfortable if he also had crushes on men.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
ITT: Anthony has strange logic?
On the romantic spectrum, I have 0% interest in guys. On the sexual spectrum, I guess you could say I'm in the middle, but I'm only in the middle because of things I"ve seen (rather than actual experiences). Can one truly base their sexual preferences on media they've seen that is, in every context, fake and altered?
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
Yes. That's precisely our point.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
So, you're suggesting that I can prefer men because I've seen gay porn? What the hell?
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
Yes.
Or, if it makes you feel any better, you could say that you had homosexual inclinations to begin with and only noticed you had them when you watched gay porn. Since (as far as I understand) you've never had homosexual feelings except in response to pornography, these two perspectives are equivalent.
Keep in mind, as I implied while expounding on my ice-cream analogy, that it's possible to like something in pornography and fantasy but not in real life. People who have fantasies of being raped wouldn't generally enjoy actual rape.
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"He is a master of 'Social Net-Working,' which, I am given to understand, is the use of certain vile technologies to advertise the existence of advertising itself, a practice which seems long overdue."
Yeah, I guess that's true...
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg
Get married
Buy her a strap-on
???
Profit
So, apparently, she was seeing this other guy behind my back while we were dating. ***** is off of my friend's list and out of my life...
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I HAVE BEEN REBORN! http://i840.photobucket.com/albums/zz325/Mountrussmore/Transformation.jpg