Abramists like to brag that they worship ethereal beings rather than objects. But isn't idol-worship something of a straw man? When people pray to or revere an object, don't they mean the object simply to be a symbol of what they worship, rather what they worship itself? Otherwise one could argue that anybody who reveres a holy symbol, even something as unanthropomorphic as a crucifix, is an idol-worshiper.
Speaking of which, the word "worshiping" doesn't have nearly enough "P"s.
---
"If I pick nine, you'd better not be racist against me!"
"No promises, niney."
I agree (on both accounts, but I wouldn't say far too few p's, just maybe one too few).
Otherwise, people who keep a statue of Buddha in a prayer room would be considered to be their antithesis.
---
SIGNATURE
I can have a picture of 'Jesus' without it being an idol, but I can also make an object like The Bible an idol, which would be a misuse of it. The idea is to not idolize something that is purely based on mans creation or understanding. If the Christian God falls under the category of being completely made up then you may have a point.
---
"...you should try reading my posts being getting all emo." --FoxMetal
I guess my question, then, is why a picture of Jesus can't be idolized whereas the Bible can—or if, in fact, they both can be idolized, what the difference between praying to an object and idolizing it is.
---
"If I pick nine, you'd better not be racist against me!"
"No promises, niney."
Anything CAN become an idol to us so a picture of Jesus as well as the Bible could yes. There doesn't have to be a difference between idolization and prayer, but there can be. I could raise my hands to the sky and call out the name of God but I wouldn't consider it making an idol of the sky, I could go into a church and pray towards a crucifix and not make it an idol, but the distinctions get real hairy as it's status as an idol is dependent on the person.
"You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below"
The passage here is directing the Jewish people to do one thing for two reasons as I see it. Don't make something specifically for worshiping, and more importantly, don't do like all of the people around you are doing (Which is one of the most significant themes in the old testament.)
When Moses comes down from the mountain and he has found his people have made a golden calf, it isn't something they have created to worship their God, but to worship the gods of nations that existed around them.
Now you asked, what's the difference between praying to an object, and idolizing it. I don't think there is a difference, but I'd be taking the question literally. Praying TO an object in hopes that THAT object will in some way answer me would be the same thing as idolizing it.
But if I were to try and answer, what's the difference between prayer, and idolatry. The only distinction would be if in fact my God, or I suppose any god really, was real. If I worshiped an object, I would be worshiping something completely man made. If I worship God, I am worshiping something that is not. The distinction is only in the context really.
---
"...you should try reading my posts being getting all emo." --FoxMetal
I think what we're getting at is that, when people worship an object, they're not actually worshiping said object (well, some quantity of them at least). They're using that object as a representation or a focal point with which they're directing their thoughts. I mean, praying to the stone god with a stone as your focal point is no different than praying to the stone god with no focal point, it's just that you have an object which helps you concentrate your thoughts. You're still praying to the stone god, and you don't believe the rock is the stone god, or even a manifestation of it even.
Or the same with a cross. No one worships the cross (never use absolutes okay okay), they just use it to focus themselves on their Christian beliefs. I don't think worshiping the stone god with a stone present is any different than anything else, and if it is in contrast to a moral code, I have to flatly disagree with the ethics of that code, and call it a petty distinction between what the codemaker "likes" and "dislikes", akin to making purple an evil color because you simply dislike it.
---
SIGNATURE
BUM spoke for me well, but to reiterate the key point: I don't think that a significant number of people pray "TO an object in hopes that THAT object will in some way answer". The idea that pagans do or did this is a caricature of paganism.
---
"If I pick nine, you'd better not be racist against me!"
"No promises, niney."
I suppose the idea is that the Idol is man made, and the God it represents is man made.
I don't think the old testament writers or God had anything against arts and crafts, it was the idea that you are worshiping a god that you created out of your own mind.
I understand that the God of the Bible could fall under that category as well, so if you looked at it from a neutral strand point then I guess you could say there was no difference between praying to God, and using an idol as a symbol of your god. That's why I was trying to get across that there is only a distinction when you accept the logic of the Bible. That is, it's not warned against because of how it's done, but what it is. And what IT WAS was generally represented in idol worship, and the Jewish people avoided the appearance of anything that had to do with outsiders.
---
"...you should try reading my posts being getting all emo." --FoxMetal
Oh. That makes more sense.
---
"If I pick nine, you'd better not be racist against me!"
"No promises, niney."
Yeah, I guess that would make sense. I was looking at it from the neutral point of view.
---
SIGNATURE